by using a Pixel…
Buy one used to not financially support them. GrapheneOS only supports Pixel phones as they are the only ones which meet the security requirements.
I will always laugh at their “security requirements”
What is wrong with them?
I’m looking into getting a Jolla, though I’m sure the security probably doesn’t match up to GrapheneOS. They seem more privacy oriented and these days I’d like to contribute to the existence of European alternatives.
Break free from Google by giving your money to Google!
I bought my Pixel 9 refurbished (as new).
Refurbished is a thing. So is
Spoiler
stealing
Doesn’t matter if it’s at the beginning or end of the pipeline. It’s feeding the demand.
I have a second hand Pixel for GrapheneOS to compromise without being compromised. Was degoogled with Lineage for many years, but it was becoming too much of a problem. I’m not happy owning literally a Google phone. Felt I had no choice.
Really, regulators are needed to sort this out. Consumer choice doesn’t work with dualopy.
I understand the complexity of supporting different hardware, but i cannot take this thing seriously while it only runs on google pixel phones.
A while ago they announced they were planning a collaboration with a big phone brand
Nothing else meets the secuirty requirements and they don’t want to comprimise.
Just use IodeOS, CalyxOS, /e/OS or just LineageOS to break free. Those are available for a many devices. Not only Pixel.
The level of security, of privacy and of granular control of those does not come even close to what GrapheneOS brings to the table. Additionally Iodè and /e/OS have some noise going on with not being private at all. And all of them, except LineageOS (some times) have long delays with security patches.
/e/OS uses OpenAI for voice-to-text. Iodé has closed source components (trust me bro?). What do they claim? “some protection is better than none”. In security that is ridiculous.
Then there is choosing between Microg vs actual sandboxed Google Play Services (which you don’t need to have at all on GrapheneOS if you don’t want to).
/e/OS signs their OS with Google test keys instead of their own keys.
Unconfirmed, but concerning is the claims of ties of those 2 (Iodé and /e/OS) with the French government, not unlike Chinese companies with the CCP.
Choosing LineageOS, or even CalyxOS are options I would consider if I wasn’t willing or able to get a Pixel device, but Iodé and /e/OS are absolute ‘no’ in my book. Too many holes, too pragmatic (and I’m trying to be nice using that word) for my taste.
the security not close, but its already a big leap from stock rom, and most likely dont need to waste money on a pixel.
yes, but you have to use a pixel.
Wao 🤣
I’m using Graphene for around a 6 months now on a Pixel 9, with F-Droid being the primary app source. I quite like it.
have you needed to use microG for any apps? is it a sufficient replacement for google play?
MicroG isn’t necessary with Grapheneos’s sandboxed Google Play.
Apart from unnecessary, pretty sure it’s also unsupported to begin with
Aurora is also a good substitute store if you don’t want to use sandboxed Google Play, but anything that uses Google Play Services will likely be borked
We need data portability laws to really untie people from these platforms.
And competition law enforced. Consumer choice doesn’t work when it’s a stitched up market like this.
I’m waiting for a phone to meet Graphene’s requirements that isn’t made by Google. Then I’ll switch. Hope it happens sooner rather than later.
I initially considered that, but in the end I just bit the bullet and got one 2 weeks ago.
My thought is with the current trend of PC hardware prices, I didn’t want to wait to see how it affects phone prices.
At the same time, I do not know if the collaborative phone between GOS and the manufacturer will be something I like. The current Pixel 10 phone is already bigger than what I ultimately prefer and I think it’s more probable the new phone will be phablet sized.
And this is something I’ve been thinking about too. While I dislike the idea of giving money to Google, it might be something I have to just make my peace with as a one time purchase for the next few years (I’m not the kind of user that has to have the newest device when it comes out). I dislike phablets too, so I always try to avoid them. I also didn’t consider PC hardware issues like ram availability and such affecting the prices of phones until now, so good of you to bring it up. I’ll think about it.
will be phablet sized
Already is… but it is what it is. Welcome to gOS, we don’t have cookies ;}
If only something more than Pixels was supported.
Blame literally every other hardware manufacturer for not implementing encryption enclaves correctly.
Most manufacturers don’t even allow you to unlock your bootloader nowadays. And the requirement of relocking it with custom keys basically means only Pixel phones (plus a few VERY old non-pixel phones) pass this absolutely basic requirement.
Oh yes the magical security black box that is 100% trust worthy! Surely nothing can ever wrong!
SOON
™
We will probably get GTA VI first.
Maybe even Star Citizen!
Do you recommend putting it on pixel 6? Or is it outdated?
If you already have one go for it. My 6 with GOS runs significantly better than my 8 with stock android. I wouldn’t buy one specifically for it though, I’d go newer since it will be supported longer.
older pixels have fewer years of GOS dev support remaining. recommend 7+
Break free from Google! By buying a Google phone…
That’s precisely my biggest problem with GrapheneOS
This betrays a deep level of tech illiteracy
Not knowing you can buy used/refurbished betrays a deep level of real life illiteracy
I know you can buy used and refurbished actually, that’s how I got my pixel. It’s still buying a Google phone. It still breaks free from Google. You have now reached the point of just regular old illiteracy I guess
Break free from Google with buying Google product? Lol
Ironic but true
Meh, there are better phones that actually support an open source community.
Fairphone with e/os has been working pretty awesome for me.
If what you care about is security though, nothing comes close to Graphene.
I care more about privacy and freedom.
Graphene has that too tho. Not sure how /e/OS is more private or free.
e/OS is fantastic, IodeOS also IMO, plenty good choices. LineageOS with rethinkDNS in whitelist only mode is also amazing
And for extra goodness supporting open source apps without trackers
All without handing yet more $$$ to nasty google, imagine that
There’s no reason not to buy a second hand Pixel.
other than a burning hatred for google that prevents you from participating in keeping the resale market high. lol
Still using Windows 10 Mobile.
GOS is great. Funny, I used to rom hop and distro hop a lot; but on GOS, I installed it once and so far so good (5+ months in).
Just some tips for new users: Just install it and dont be afraid to try things out (Google Store, profiles, Aurora…etc). Oh and dont make it tooooo complicate with many profiles and private space. You can test first but dont over do it if you’re not experienced.
And no, I am not a dev from GOS lol. I’m an ordinary user who wants to take control of my phone.
Another reply did the thinking emoji face at biometrics and that’s good. Here’s why it’s worthwhile to never enable biometrics:
You don’t know when you’re going to be compelled to use them and you don’t drill on turning them off.
The whole point of no knock and other police tactics is to prevent you from keeping them from getting what they want. You can’t expect yourself to just never be surprised, that’s ridiculous. Turn biometrics off so getting surprised by the cops doesn’t immediately give them the keys to the castle!
No one drills enough, but let’s say you’re the one person who does drill enough on turning off biometrics: wouldn’t that practice time be better spent with biometrics off, drilling on shutting your phone down so they have to deal with its much more secure Before First Unlock state instead?
Turn off biometrics and practice turning your phone off.
I wonder is this something to actually worry about outside of the US?
In my country police are known to torture people until they sign a confession written by them. So I don’t think disabling biometrics will make a difference. But I’ve still done it.
nobody should discount hardware-level hacks either. ultimately GOS is the only way to get decent software on mobile without leaving it exposed in the event of petty theft. people implying it will be a serious roadblock to imperialist state-level actors are naive or even suspicious to me
Yes it absolutely is.
Every nation has a byzantine system of laws and codes enumerating different ways for police to violate the “rights” that nation has enshrined in law.
One way to avoid compelled speech (a “right” Americans have but other nations citizens might not) is to simply misremember your lock code as many times as it takes to trigger factory reset.
Americans don’t need to know that because they can’t be compelled to enter a passkey, but people in countries with no qualms about compelled speech like Germany would be well served by disabling biometrics so they have the option of lying and taking that hit instead of giving up their privacy.
Do your own research about your jurisdiction, but go ahead and turn off biometrics because it literally makes any group that can control your movement (which in English common law is the basis for the concept of “arrest”, and so likely a situation many different nationalities will face) access to your devices.
FWIW gOS has a duress PIN baked in. Doesn’t stop the rubber hose but at least you can be smug ;}
The duress pin seems like such a cool feature, but I feel like it flies a little too close to the sun.
Misremembering your own pin ten times stretches the limit of credulity, but a lawyer could argue that under the circumstances of enhanced interrogation you weren’t able.
Expressly giving the wrong answer in a place with compelled speech threatens to add a million new legal hurdles to your freedom.
When you fuck it up ten times they’re gonna try to slap you with those charges anyway but at least you have some defense instead of it being an open and shut case of “he’s recorded entering the evidence destruction button when we asked him nicely to instead let us push the evidence retrieval button”
For assange types (and I mean people actively under threat by a nation which has a set of charges it’s investigating or planting evidence for, not people who have leaked documents or share his ideals) it’s a good thing, but anyone not dodging the “if I walk out of the embassy they’ll “find” cp on my phone” bullet it seems like more trouble than it’s worth.
Valid in many cases (hence the rubber hose quip), I was merely responding to above. It does have use as a quick way to burn it all down before any requests are made.
Yeah sorry to hit you with a wall of text.
Between all the people who refuse to use graphene because it’s on pixels and the ones who seem like they haven’t been keeping up with the news or even had any interaction with cops this thread is deeply disturbing and hitting all the buttons that make me wanna say No Don’t Do That!
Who knows, maybe there’s a good case where someone uses the duress and gets away with it. I think assange did once before…
“all laws are local, and no law knows how local it is”, which is to say it on the user to understand their local legal (and political) situation. It’s a big world.
I ran various custom ROM’s for years on a FairPhone3+. It was great right up until the day all my banking apps stopped working. Banking app incompatibility is NOT the fault of GrapheneOS (or any other custom ROM) dev’s at all . . . but IMO this is the real problem today with any alternative mobile OS. Privacy vs. banking convenience. And yes, YMMV as some of them do work . . and mine did as well . . right up until the day they didn’t.
Just use a web browser.
People act like they can’t live without these apps, which are often just a repackaged website anyway.
Nice idea in theory . . . but here in the UK, increasingly customers are being left with little other choice. Between banking apps using push messages to verify credit/debit card transactions, closing of physical branches and requiring authentication via the app to log into the website . . . not using their app is becoming more and more difficult every day.
I would use banking through the browser for sure, but to be able to login on the browser i can only receive the pin through the app. not only this ,but everytime i make a purchase online I have to authorize the transaction through the app. There is no other way, they don’t even offer a physical token anymore.
If you don’t mind disclosing, what bank is that?
It’s the Romanian Commercial Bank founded to take over the commercial banking operations of the National Bank of Romania in 1990.
My bank requires using a card reader for ID if you use a web browser. It can be done but it means carrying three physical things (phone, bank card, bank card reader) instead of one (phone).
So it is a minor inconvenience?
Also it would be an option to switch banks.
My point is that there is an actual difference. It’s not just a repackaged web app, and has actual drawbacks.
My personal plan is to move as much of my day to day stuff to a Mecha Comet, and also carry my Fairphone running Android for whatever proprietary crap that the world wants me to run. It’s two devices, but hopefully will minimize exposure to big tech.
pushTAN?
Do banking exclusively through the online portals? For me, if that means using my desktop or a laptop for banking, that’s what I do, because I will not install a banking app on my phone.
Nice idea in theory . . . but here in the UK, increasingly customers are being left with little other choice. Between banking apps using push messages to verify credit/debit card transactions, closing of physical branches and requiring authentication via the app to log into the website . . . not using their app is becoming more and more difficult every day.
What services do they have for senior citizens? Because they are the most likely ones to not want to use technology. You can probably piggyback on what they use.
They are offering free classes for seniors to teach them how to use the apps.
not every bank lets you
Switch banks. That’s what I did. I had a bank that required an app to use them as well before I decided that I cared about my privacy and wanted more of it. And when I found out that my bank wouldn’t let me do things, I switched banks. Because fuck them.
Generally it’s neobanks that cause the most problems. If you’re using older banks that have been around for quite a long time, they don’t have nearly the technology, so are less likely to have this occur. In the United States, an example of this might be something like Wells Fargo or Discover or something like that, whereas one of these neobanks that would cause problems would be like chime.
Generally, stay away from thin tech and stay with actual banks. You might also look at credit unions. My local credit union is really good, and has a good online website, and has an app as well, but doesn’t require it at all.
I use several banks and several credit unions, and the only thing I can’t do with a laptop is deposit checks (which is getting pretty rare).
FinTech products like PayPal, Venmo, Cash.app, BlueBird and such often require a phone app, but aren’t regulated banks, and are best avoided when possible.
Same here, I might end up with a check in my hands like once per year, and so I have to make like one single trip to my credit union every single year or whatever to deposit that check, and that’s it.
i’m not aware of any i can switch to in my country that doesn’t require a phone and an annoying pairing process.
I might make a post about banks that don’t require apps or collect data. Mine is stupid about it if you don’t opt out. I’m so sick of every business normalizing this.
my condolences are you euro?
south american.
I didn’t know they rolled like that, good to know for the purposes of learning about banking & surveillance systems. haven’t seen it mentioned on GOS forums
the facial scanning tech you guys are starting to see used against you now has been trialed in your colonies first to make sure it works well for them.
boomerang is just now coming back on this one.
Exactly! I’d love to switch, but I rely on my banking apps too much. That’s a dealbreaker for me as well.
Nfc payments keep me chained. I guess i can get a second phone just for setting up a watch, but i don’t want a watch. So i live by not using the default launcher and a vpn. I’m working to change my email provider slowly
